Lighting desk

[emilianomorgia]

not true - go look at keystone controls n the mix window - click and drag!!

I was referring to DMX controllers not to the catalyst it self



Hog was advanced for its time, but AVO, ETC, JANDS compulite all have good range of desks - not all as good as each other for dealing with media servers - but good in their field and unique from the Hog2

Vista is a great desk - ideally suited for timeline programming....

You can't say that, Vista it's soo young , and so incomplete

NEVER - people like hands on FADERS and KNOBS - mice are a pain! - you can only control one thing at once with a mouse or even touchscreen. Faders and knobs allow programmers to do more than one thing at once.

Fader it's not the CPU , faders does not cost 40.000 euro

Well you;ve just contradicted yourself and re-afirmed he need for hardware!

Input Device are not the the Desk it self ! Come on ! a desk it's not made of faders ! Yes some need hardware ( fader and wheels ) some does not , ( I don't )

not true - Hog PC works great!

Hog Pc is good as I said in my post , but it's SIMULATOR . there is nothing you can say that change the fact that it's simulate the real desk .

So im still not clear - are you pro hardware or software lighting desks?

It's Catalyst an hardware or a software Tool ?

[Mr_P]

well - catalyst is a video software tool that by defenition uses hardware to operate! .... and I think we were discusing lighting desks - not catalyst here though...

Vista is at least 3 years old and has gone through huge continual development (including hardware for PC based systems!)

Hog PC may have started out as a simulator - however, it now forms the core of the iPC

I can't accept that you think a software only version of any lighting desk is a substitute for the real thing. In some cases, it may be a budget alternative for simple installs or learning - but never a real alternative on a live gig.

[emilianomorgia]

do you remember the Status Cue ?

What I wish it's a Strong Software and a flexible control surface .

[SourceChild]

If you want Hog III libraries written, you need to talk to Hog III librarian. He is usually pretty quick.

Yes, he will actually turn one out in about 24 hours if you ask.

I find the Hogs more ergonomic and the syntax is more elegant than the Grand MA.

It's only when you add two external touch monitors does it become cumbersome but still easier to single hand program than an MA.

Personally, I still program most of my shows on a Hog 2 OS system - preferably a Hog 2...It's a better media server programming platform than the 3...

I personally have always hated the Hog2 and actually fought against someone providing it on shows I was programming. I would pick a Virt, Spark, Pearl, or Diamond back in the days before Hog3.

I even opposed the Hog3 until I discovered the EDITOR.

Honestly, the editor in hog3 is the only reason I love it over any other desk. I believe it is that editor that makes the hog3 far superior to any other desk including and especially hog2.

...Hog2...It's simple to write you're own libraries for it too. There are still a few tricks that only the Hog 2 can do...

I design custom automation devices and the only other desks besides hog2 that are fast and reliable for users writing reliable libraries are AVO desks which I don't mind but don't offer the complexity I desire.

the fades are predicable, and the DMX does what you program. The Hog III still has rounding issues between real world values and DMX.

Being a hog3 expert and knowing all about these little bugs, I will agree with you completely.

[SourceChild]

do you remember the Status Cue ?

What I wish it's a Strong Software and a flexible control surface .

Oh GOD! I freaking hate that old desk. No multipart fades and no FX generator.

[SourceChild]

Vista is at least 3 years old and has gone through huge continual development (including hardware for PC based systems!)

Vista is a pain in the ass. I can't begin to tell you how slow it is in comparison to a H3, Maxxyz, Vector, or MA. It's all about shortcuts, key combination, and command lines that speed up programming for me.

Even though I love the idea of timeline programming, vista is still slower for me to program complex cues and timeline elements very fast. But I just know tricks most users still haven't learned yet

I can't accept that you think a software only version of any lighting desk is a substitute for the real thing. In some cases, it may be a budget alternative for simple installs or learning - but never a real alternative on a live gig.

On the contrary. I don't like software only control but there are some things that Sunlite and Light Jockey can do quickly that don't require hardware.

Check out Nicolaudie and look at Sunlite. It is a relatively fast software based programmer and you can write your own custom libraries. And for under $1,000 USD, it's pretty damned capable.

[emilianomorgia]

Oh GOD! I freaking hate that old desk. No multipart fades and no FX generator.

Sure ! 10 or more years ago !!!!

but what was that ? an external CPU with a control surface .

[OlliR]

I can only second Hugh´s view on things:

The Hog2 is still a great console for live media server control.

Complex timing is easily programmed and I can change the library as I need it. For example I like to sepearte parameters to Focus and Beam (Xpos, Ypos, Rotation, Scale, Aspectratio are Focus (or Position) parameters for me).
That makes masking the things I need much more easy.

But the Hog2 are loosing their shape on the hardware side. I often find Grandmasters that will no longer output full 100% - and that is a pain in the a.. when your layers get transparent if you don´t want them to. There also is the "stuck choose button" issue that can drive you crazy...

Hog3 is a good replacement for Hog2. The Programmer is more powerful - especially aplying timing is faster than on any other console.
But there are still some bugs with updating a cuelist that is live on stage - so you need to be careful.

The MA is a good console but it is not my way of programming a show. Complex timing gets you selecting single cells in spreadsheets and a lot of wheel turning and clicking...

[SourceChild]

For example I like to sepearte parameters to Focus and Beam (Xpos, Ypos, Rotation, Scale, Aspectratio are Focus (or Position) parameters for me).

Remember that on a Hog3, you can split a palette window. I have several shows where I have all four touch monitors up and have two beam palettes open, a group and color on one monitor and still have my editor open and since all 4 are touch screens, this screams through.

Yes, I agree that HES should create media sever library files that put the position parameters on the position palette but also remember that the reason they put all media server parameters on beam is that beam is a "per function" split palette.

Most uses want to keep position as a "per type" instead of a "per parameter" so that you don't accidentally get x only and miss y.

Of course if there was a way at the root level of the Hog3 that would allow a user to split palette parameter grouping "per fixture type" then this would all be solved. (It was a request I send HES about 2 years ago)